To flip or not

[grubbyjeans]

I cannot see how an axle flip will make the camper "ride harder" or cause tire issues unless the axle is placed out of square to the frame in the process of the flip. youre still supporting the same amount of weight, at the same point from front to back. the main issue I can see possibly coming out of it is keeping the camper level front to back with a higher stance. I had to flip my ball on the ball mount to tow this Mesa with my Dakota (stock height) and have the camper level. Nose high trailer or butt high can cause it to tow like crap. You want sway? tow with front or back of trailer higher than the other end.  ball mounts are relatively cheap.
Without seeing "how" they did the flip I cant tell you how to reverse it. I have built a few trailers over the years (flatbed utility types) from scratch. I have replaced several axles. I have shortened mobile home axles for use in a different application.  but without seeing what we are dealing with. I cant say.
Regarding re using U bolts. If they are the least bit rusty I get the torch out, wack em off and go buy new. but you dont live in the salt belt either. My son has a truck we bought out of Vegas and drove back to Chicago. working on a rustfree vehicle is all the difference in the world. so I cant say whether Id reuse anything in your case or not.

and seeing the title to this thread I was thinking "flip" in terms of buy for the sake of resale/ make a buck sort of thing, til I read the posts.

If the axle had a built in camber, then flipping it would reverse the camber from positive to negative. Loading the axle would then increase the negative camber and cause abnormal tire wear. It would have the same effect as overloading an axle.  http://blog.easternmarine.com/trailer-axle-camber-what-its-all-about/

Results of a weak axle on my Royal

I just flipped the hitch to adjust towing height to keep the trailer in balance.

[Redwood]

  Look at 79Ramada's picture didn't he do it just right? Isn't this what you're talking about getting the camber just the way it should be?  

   If you haven't seen his pictures of his axle flip check them out. http://www.apachepopups.net/smf/index.php?action=media;sa=album;in=464

[grubbyjeans]

  Look at 79Ramada's picture didn't he do it just right? Isn't this what you're talking about getting the camber just the way it should be?  

   If you haven't seen his pictures of his axle flip check them out. http://www.apachepopups.net/smf/index.php?action=media;sa=album;in=464

It isn't clear from that pic whether he actually 'flipped' the axle, or if he just changed to SOA configuration, though it DOES appear that the old saddle is on the bottom on the right wheel. The axle also appears to be bowed up toward the center.

Here is a pic from his gallery that shows clearly that he maintained the orientation of the axle bow as he welded a new saddle on top of the axle.
[smg id=6838]

[Redwood]

  So Ray,
  I believe I'm understanding how this should be done. I'll take a look at my axle tomorrow and see what was done on mine. The PO said it has an axle flip and I did see the axle bolted on to the bottom of the springs. Now I guess I need to look at the camber of the axle. I'll take some pictures of how everything looks under there and post them. If I keep the trailer raised I at least want it to be done right.  Thank you guys for your help.

[grubbyjeans]

  So Ray,
  I believe I'm understanding how this should be done. I'll take a look at my axle tomorrow and see what was done on mine. The PO said it has an axle flip and I did see the axle bolted on to the bottom of the springs. Now I guess I need to look at the camber of the axle. I'll take some pictures of how everything looks under there and post them. If I keep the trailer raised I at least want it to be done right.  Thank you guys for your help.

Good idea.

[79Ramada]

Hi Greg,

Just a quick FAQ on suspension modification for ground clearance here.

In order to gain more gound clearance, and not having to deal with leaf springs and axle you can simply get larger diameter wheel set. This only works to a certain point where the wheel will not fit inside the wheel well. My original Ramada wheels are 5.3x12. 13" wheels may fit in there but not sure it has enough clearance if the trailer bounces on the road.

This is when we move to the next step of mounting the axle under the leaf springs. This is commonly called SOA, spring over axle modification. You can mount the axle under the spring two ways.
First method is so called "Axle Flip". When the axle is in the original configuration, above the spring, the spring perch is welded UNDER the axle, and the U bolts nuts and spring plate would be facing toward the ground. If we are to mount the axle under the leaf spring, or SOA, the spring perch needed to be on top of the axle. For a straight axles, you can simply flip the axle upside down, so now the spring perch is on top. This method does not involve any welding, just moving parts around. (Greg, if yours has a true axle flip, the suspension mod will be in this catagory)
Here is the Second method, for axle with chamber built in, aka, axle is slightly crowned and it is bowed toward the sky. In order to maintained that camber, you are best to weld new spring perches on top of the axle. This method do involve welding and making sure the spring perches are welded the same spacing as the old ones. This method not only gain extra ground clearance by mounting the axle away from the tailer body, also allows larger diameter wheels which provide additional clearance. The U bolt nuts and the spring plates will be facing toward the sky. (My Ramada suspension mod is in this catagory and write up to my mod here.. http://www.apachepopups.net/smf/index.php?topic=12812.0 )

The above methods are generally enough ground clearance for most folks, but if that is still not enough, the next step is to replace the leaf spring with additional arch or lift. This usually involve new spring mounts and welding. This also means some frame modification needed in order for the new spring mounts etc.. This is usually done by serious offroad camping crowd with their tow vehicle also has some serious suspension lift. Here is an example of that, which is also a form of SOA suspension. http://www.apachepopups.net/smf/index.php?topic=12865.0

[Redwood]

  Thank you 79Ramada that made it more clear what is being done with the axles. I also can take a good look at mine and see what has been done by the PO.
  Does anyone know if the original axle in a 76 Roamer had camber to it or was it just straight? Maybe Terry, he has a 76 Roamer. I'll post some pictures later today. Thanks everyone.

[Terry]

Not going to be able to help you with this one.  the camper is setting with grass growing around it and I don't have a tow vehicle to pull it out.

[Pescador]

Greg, 79Ramada did the correct flip for his existing Axel. If I were you Greg I would look to see if it was done right and decide from there. I think the ride stay pretty much the same to me unless you are going scary fast! My trailer tends to sway more on small angled roads but I can easily go 70 plus miles on freeway which is good enough for me! . I think Bonnie is right to want to get a little more clearance for the sake of gear box clearance! Greg, I would not bring it down since the hard work has been already done for you. I would do like Bonnie said and make a simple little 4 or 5 inche stepping stool and then your at the same height as before like the Mesa! I love my Axel being flipped and I'm sure you will see as well as soon as you get use to it!

[Redwood]

  OK here are some pictures of the existing axle flip that was done on the Roamer I bought. I haven't had time to take measurements yet to see if it's all done correct. The perch has been welded on the axle and that makes me think the axle had camber to it. The frame is pretty bad where the axle goes through. After seeing 79Ramada's set up mine looks bad. Anyway guys what do you think? Comments or suggestions.   Pictures    http://www.apachepopups.net/smf/index.php?action=media;sa=album;in=479

[79Ramada]

From this picture alone, your axle is installed properly with a new spring perch welded on top of the axle.



And from this picture looks like there is enough cross bracing so the frame should be fine too. PO has added an angle iron and installed the original bracket one bolt hole lower to clear the axle.

[79Ramada]

I did noticed PO had hack the sides off the original lower frame bracket, looks a bit bent too. Here is a picture of the original bracket. Pictures shows both sides of the original bracket.

[RangerBob]

Crude but effective. Not pretty but safe... in my opinion.

Bob

[Pescador]

 8)Greg,

The axel was raised properly! If you want to make it pretty than wire brush and paint and have a welder make you a fancy bracket! The wiring for the brakes looks good as well. I would not lower it to stock after some invested enough time to weld proper brackets to mount the springs!

[gundoger]

 Not the prettiest job I've ever seen but it looks like all the spring work was done right. Think I would take the lower frame bracket off and have a plate welded on that came down from the top of the opening about 4-5 inches for added strength.
 I would put on double steps depending on how high it is, I sure like mine. Not hard to fabricate hangers to bolt into with a couple of pieces of 2"x2" angle iron.
 If it rides good and stable I would leave it raised, don't have to worry about speed bumps and steep driveway's.